• PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      21 days ago

      No, it was always “Ukraine is winning but might lose if we don’t help” because obviously if they just said “Ukraine is winning” then the help would be not needed.

      • tiredturtle@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        21 days ago

        It was “Ukraine is on the verge of losing each second but a few weapons can keep their head above water until a peace is negotiated”

        • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          6
          ·
          21 days ago

          No it wasn’t, nobody official in Ukraine or west even talked about negotiating peace, the terms was always basically unconditional surrender of Russia and conquest of Crimea.

            • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              3
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              21 days ago

              I mean they didn’t officially called Russia to surrender, but after the first talks were sabotaged by Johnson, official stance of Ukraine, supported by their western helpers was (and still is) that Russia should entirely left borders of Ukraine including Donbas and also give them Crimea. The only situation in which this could happen is Russia’s surrender (and historically such maximum one sided demands also only happened after surrendering of one side).