I’ve read these stories multiple times now and I still don’t quite understand what’s happening.
Why do these people think, burning down the offices does anything? I mean, the “scammers” apparently tell them, it’s their patriotic duty to do so, but what weird mixture of slave mentality and superiority complex do you have to have to think it’s your duty to burn down military buildings for some shady kabal of a patriotic underground?
Well, it doesn’t make it easier to enlist. And it doesn’t target civilians. And it sends the message that there are folks operating in the area that have the means to do these things. No matter who it is.
There is a tremendous amount of cultural weight behind this. The Russian Revolution began on International Woman’s Day 1917 when crowds of women, often older, gathered in St Petersburg to protest the price of bread and the ongoing insanity of the Great War. Those women started the fire that would burn down the Czarist State
I’ve read these stories multiple times now and I still don’t quite understand what’s happening.
That’s because it’s mostly lies and propaganda not aimed at you, but the Russian people.
Russians have been burning those offices for over a year, with it ramping up after people started getting forcefully recruited. Russia as always is trying to say it’s not “real russians” doing it, but people influenced by “the evil west”. It’s their standard strategy when it comes to pretty much any set back, ever. In this case it’s mostly blamed on “evil ukranian scammers”, so they can keep justifying the invasion and occupation.
Are you saying the story the Russian media is telling makes no sense? Because on that I agree, but it’s hard to understand if that’s what you mean, it’s just my best guess.
This kind of narrative, “Our enemies are weak willed patsies falling for phone scams and simultaneously dangerous and capable insurrectionists,” is typical of fascist propaganda. It’s Umberto Eco’s 8th feature of fascism: “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
If you’re wondering why people are really doing it:
It sends a very clear message: stop forcing children to die for your invasion.
Also, the offices exist to facilitate the process of enlistment, so it stands to reason that if they’re destroyed then that process will be slowed, even if just for a while.
People putting their lives on the line to resist imperialism aren’t going to hear much criticism from me.
No, the story the “arsonists” are telling makes no sense. And there’s too little information out there to determine whether this is just a fabrication by the Russian state or actually what happened.
Of course the Russian state is lying. You can tell because what they’re saying makes no sense. Also because they’re the Russian state. They have an explicit strategy that they call the firehose of disinformation.
As for the other story, I mean it might make sense if it’s a false flag, who knows? The Russian state can send people to invade Ukraine, it can send people to burn down a couple of buildings.
Edit: I am making a note of this typo edit just to highlight the fact that “sfate” is a funny word.
I mean tbf the track record is very clear. Russia can’t be trusted. But ofc you are right, we also don’t know if we can trust the arsonists.
I have a feeling those arsonists are trying to put this on state actors so the Russian government has to distance themselves this making their story even more confusing and less plausible. I think it’s just a novel way to attack the Russian narrative.
I have two thoughts about this, and I’ll be the first to admit that I’m nowhere near qualified to say if either of them are even close to the mark.
The first, and probably more optimistic, is that they’re trying to find people who are sympathetic to the pro-ukrainian/anti-putin cause and giving them sort of a plausible deniability to act on those sympathies. That way if they get caught they can say “No of course not, I would never help Ukraine, I love the motherland, the man on the phone said this was good for Russia and that’s why I did it”
The second is that a lot of people out there are just plain stupid. When you listen to even regular run-of-the-mill phone scammers, people fall for some absolutely bullshit stuff, I really wouldn’t be too surprised if you could, with a little perseverance and choosing your words carefully, convince the same kind of people who think it’s perfectly reasonable that the IRS will take payments in the form of Roblox gift cards to go commit arson.
EDIT: those 2 thoughts are based on the assumption that these scammers actually exist, there is also of course, option 3- Russia’s lying or is dumb, there are no scammers doing this, the people doing this know full well what they’re doing, and either A- this is just the government trying to cover it up with a bullshit story about scammers convincing people to do it, or B- that’s the story the people doing this are giving and the Russian government is actually dumb enough to believe it.
It seems much more probable that russians just don’t want to be drafted. Of course Russia blames Ukraine, but it’s a pretty far out story to be pass even as fake news.
Anyway, even if it’s true, it doesn’t exactly put Russians in a good light, if they’re so incredibly dumb that they can be scammed into setting fire to military offices.
It’s a Russia-problem either way, and their reaction is to wave their arms around.
N russians have their dumb people like any other culture.
But ye; to me it would make more sense that some antiwar russians mighta done it; just because what else can they really do to fight this regime?
They tried protesting, they tried fleeing ETC. + they’re not wanted anywhere even if they did succeed in their escape…
Sooo idk…
One thing I bet on ; is after the war ( if there is an after ) the world should help reform / rebuild russia n bring in democracy or else russia will ALWAYS go back to it’s inhumane/corrupt/brutal/shitty ways …
This is a country that NEVER had a democracy so it needs intervention 1000% ASAP… Plus I wouldn’t mind if russia in 'turn gave up some of its land/territory/labor/resources to form new countries for refugees, natives, Gypsies, Minorities ETC …
{Goes without saying after the war Russia should absolutely pay reparations to Ukraine and EU too}
I’ve read these stories multiple times now and I still don’t quite understand what’s happening.
Why do these people think, burning down the offices does anything? I mean, the “scammers” apparently tell them, it’s their patriotic duty to do so, but what weird mixture of slave mentality and superiority complex do you have to have to think it’s your duty to burn down military buildings for some shady kabal of a patriotic underground?
Well, it doesn’t make it easier to enlist. And it doesn’t target civilians. And it sends the message that there are folks operating in the area that have the means to do these things. No matter who it is.
Look up, who this is. Grandmas. And they claim to act on behalf of some patriotic group in the government that is actually pro war.
And that just doesn’t make sense. 90 years old women standing in the middle of the street with Molotov cocktails. Literally, that’s no exaggeration.
Nothing makes sense in Russia and never did. Just relax and enjoy the show!
There is a tremendous amount of cultural weight behind this. The Russian Revolution began on International Woman’s Day 1917 when crowds of women, often older, gathered in St Petersburg to protest the price of bread and the ongoing insanity of the Great War. Those women started the fire that would burn down the Czarist State
Damn! Good to know. Thank you for the history lesson. It gives me some hope!
How doesn’t it make it easier to enlist? Please explain if You wouldn’t mind ?
That’s because it’s mostly lies and propaganda not aimed at you, but the Russian people.
Russians have been burning those offices for over a year, with it ramping up after people started getting forcefully recruited. Russia as always is trying to say it’s not “real russians” doing it, but people influenced by “the evil west”. It’s their standard strategy when it comes to pretty much any set back, ever. In this case it’s mostly blamed on “evil ukranian scammers”, so they can keep justifying the invasion and occupation.
It’s standard strategy for every nation ever.
Are you saying the story the Russian media is telling makes no sense? Because on that I agree, but it’s hard to understand if that’s what you mean, it’s just my best guess.
This kind of narrative, “Our enemies are weak willed patsies falling for phone scams and simultaneously dangerous and capable insurrectionists,” is typical of fascist propaganda. It’s Umberto Eco’s 8th feature of fascism: “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
If you’re wondering why people are really doing it:
It sends a very clear message: stop forcing children to die for your invasion.
Also, the offices exist to facilitate the process of enlistment, so it stands to reason that if they’re destroyed then that process will be slowed, even if just for a while.
People putting their lives on the line to resist imperialism aren’t going to hear much criticism from me.
No, the story the “arsonists” are telling makes no sense. And there’s too little information out there to determine whether this is just a fabrication by the Russian state or actually what happened.
Both are stupid, but in slightly different ways.
Of course the Russian state is lying. You can tell because what they’re saying makes no sense. Also because they’re the Russian state. They have an explicit strategy that they call the firehose of disinformation.
As for the other story, I mean it might make sense if it’s a false flag, who knows? The Russian state can send people to invade Ukraine, it can send people to burn down a couple of buildings.
Edit: I am making a note of this typo edit just to highlight the fact that “sfate” is a funny word.
I mean tbf the track record is very clear. Russia can’t be trusted. But ofc you are right, we also don’t know if we can trust the arsonists.
I have a feeling those arsonists are trying to put this on state actors so the Russian government has to distance themselves this making their story even more confusing and less plausible. I think it’s just a novel way to attack the Russian narrative.
I have two thoughts about this, and I’ll be the first to admit that I’m nowhere near qualified to say if either of them are even close to the mark.
The first, and probably more optimistic, is that they’re trying to find people who are sympathetic to the pro-ukrainian/anti-putin cause and giving them sort of a plausible deniability to act on those sympathies. That way if they get caught they can say “No of course not, I would never help Ukraine, I love the motherland, the man on the phone said this was good for Russia and that’s why I did it”
The second is that a lot of people out there are just plain stupid. When you listen to even regular run-of-the-mill phone scammers, people fall for some absolutely bullshit stuff, I really wouldn’t be too surprised if you could, with a little perseverance and choosing your words carefully, convince the same kind of people who think it’s perfectly reasonable that the IRS will take payments in the form of Roblox gift cards to go commit arson.
EDIT: those 2 thoughts are based on the assumption that these scammers actually exist, there is also of course, option 3- Russia’s lying or is dumb, there are no scammers doing this, the people doing this know full well what they’re doing, and either A- this is just the government trying to cover it up with a bullshit story about scammers convincing people to do it, or B- that’s the story the people doing this are giving and the Russian government is actually dumb enough to believe it.
If the FSB tell you to do something, you do it.
It seems much more probable that russians just don’t want to be drafted. Of course Russia blames Ukraine, but it’s a pretty far out story to be pass even as fake news.
Anyway, even if it’s true, it doesn’t exactly put Russians in a good light, if they’re so incredibly dumb that they can be scammed into setting fire to military offices.
It’s a Russia-problem either way, and their reaction is to wave their arms around.
That’s what I was thinking too …
N russians have their dumb people like any other culture.
But ye; to me it would make more sense that some antiwar russians mighta done it; just because what else can they really do to fight this regime?
They tried protesting, they tried fleeing ETC. + they’re not wanted anywhere even if they did succeed in their escape…
Sooo idk…
One thing I bet on ; is after the war ( if there is an after ) the world should help reform / rebuild russia n bring in democracy or else russia will ALWAYS go back to it’s inhumane/corrupt/brutal/shitty ways …
This is a country that NEVER had a democracy so it needs intervention 1000% ASAP… Plus I wouldn’t mind if russia in 'turn gave up some of its land/territory/labor/resources to form new countries for refugees, natives, Gypsies, Minorities ETC …
{Goes without saying after the war Russia should absolutely pay reparations to Ukraine and EU too}